From KELOLAND:
A Minnesota volunteer firefighter says he’s been suspended for flying a confederate flag from an engine during a holiday parade, and that he expects to be asked to resign.
and..
Neilsen says he flew the flag because he’s fed up with political correctness and didn’t realize how much trouble it would cause.
Well, that probably wasn’t the smartest thing to do, given it was his employer’s truck and not his to stage his protest against political correctness. And I don’t recall that Albert Lea Minnesota has ever been noted as a hotbed of confederate support. But I suspect it’s less that the man wanted to express a rebel yell, followed with a “don’t-cha-know” as much as make a statement against what seems to be an overreaching sense of hyper-sensitivity that infects our nation at this point in our history.
Ever since the media latched on to an image of a man who tragically killed several black church goers posing with a confederate flag, the flag has become a lightning rod and a symbol for racism in our society, and it’s instantly being erased in every context imaginable. It’s probably not the only time someone of ill-repute has posed with it, but for some reason, banning it has become the de facto response to prove one’s self as not being racist.
150 years after the war, should it be flown over statehouses? I’d argue no. It really doesn’t have a place among our state or national symbols. But, as a nation, the fact remains it was part of our history, and we should be able to display it in that context. Ever since the civil war, it has also been a symbol of rebellion and nonconformity. Some would say it’s display is more of a statement of “Don’t tread on me” as opposed to “we need to secede again.”
But in our society where we’ve now made up the term “Microagressions,” and include notations of America as the land of opportunity as a microagression, the banning of the flag has quickly moved to full blown hysteria. I think the flag banning movement showed it’s extremes when the Apple Store went so far as to ban the confederate flag in games about the civil war:
“We have removed apps from the App Store that use the Confederate flag in offensive or mean-spirited ways, which is in violation of our guidelines,” a spokesperson said to BuzzFeed News. The company denied issuing a blanket ban however, stating that the flag can be shown for “educational or historical uses.”
The decision has, however, forced a number of American Civil War games off of the App Store, even though developers insist the Confederate flag was only used to be historically accurate.
Sources told BuzzFeed that Apple is working with affected game developers to get their apps back in the App Store. The company is reportedly asking them to remove or replace the offending flag, however.
So, how exactly does one re-enact the civil war without the confederate flag? And how exactly does banning the flag in that context make any headway in bridging the racial divide in this country?
Are we that far gone that we now have to call one side the shirts and the other side the skins? I’m not sure how they’re going to digitally replace the flag on top of the Dukes of Hazzard car to render the show airable again, but when you see things like that, I can maybe even sympathize a little with the firefighter in Albert Lea, Minnesota.
It doesn’t seem ‘Minnesota’s Confederate Flag guy’ was endorsing a symbol he thought racist. It seems he was protesting a society deep in the grip of a hysteria to ban ideas and symbols, as opposed to solving real problems.
For better or worse, the confederate flag is part of our history as a nation. If we as a society have people pressing to ban the use of a flag even in historical contexts, that should trouble us far more than whether it’s plastered on the top of a car in a TV show, or it’s used to represent the rebels in a civil war re-enactment video game.
And it does nothing to solve the root problems of racism in this country. That’s where the real focus should be.
Rocket science
Yes, I guess it is better to give in to the screeching banshees of political correctness and bow to the pressure put on by the brilliant minds who voice their every opinion on social media.
Political correctness has run amok, and some people in their hysteria to claim that they are not racist are going to extremes such as this flag issue. Most people never saw the Confederate flag as anything more than a historical symbol of the Confederacy, and most people didn’t give it a second thought until all this mass hysteria started. And racism was never as much an issue as it has become in the last several years; anyone wonder why that is?! Banning the flag is nothing more than a feel good response to the act of a murderous and crazy man that committed a horrendous deed. It solves nothing and actually creates more divisiveness. Maybe that is actually the motive behind this?
When I see a beat up, battered Chevy truck on the streets of Sioux Falls with a Confederate flag flying from the box of the truck, I don’t think of the driver of the truck as honoring the Confederacy. Well, maybe he is honoring it and wishing it were still a valid, functioning entity. The Confederacy wanted to keep slavery legal. The flag is a symbol of a temporary government that wanted slaves. The symbol’s time has passed.
“The Confederacy wanted to keep slavery legal. ”
Well, that was a small part of the quarrel.
“The flag is a symbol of a temporary government that wanted slaves”
Actually, NO.
1. The “rebel flag” was NOT the flag of the Confederacy.
2. The vast majority of those who fought under the rebel flag did not own slaves, cared little for the plantation culture, and fought for OTHER reasons.
But, let’s not allow the cold facts of history distort our feelings, right?
PLEASE, do a bit of reading before posting again. Bigot.
Mr. Powers and minions,
As you know, the terms “politically correct” and “political correctness” were invented and are used continually by BIGOTS attempting to shield themselves from valid criticism. Correct is correct, no matter what qualifier is added as a prefix.
Actually, if you research the issue, the term seems to have come in vogue from the left:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_correctness
Bringing facts into the discussion, Pat? How is Portair supposed to stand a chance?
Is it true that blaming others is a leftie trait?
Your assumption is that you and your mindless minions ARE correct, Portair, but they are more often than not incorrect. If I could buy you for what I think of you and sell you for what you think of yourself I could retire.
Porterhouse:
As you know, the suggestion that PC was “invented” by bigots is an invention by those “progressives” and other democrats who continually try to avoid responsibility for their own racist acts such as slavery and segregation and putting the rebel flag above state capitals throughout the south.
Nice try buddy.
You mean like the queercommunity invented the word “homophobe” to denigrate those who don’t agree with their abnormal and deviant behavior?
And technically, the word ‘homophobe’ would mean an irrational fear of homosapiens. To be PC, the correct term might be “gayphobe” or ‘queerphobe’ or some other such nonsense.
I see his point, even though it is misguided.
This firefighter was just expressing an emotional reaction that many have when they perceive that someone is “trying to tell them what to do”. We need to forgive him, because he probably wasn’t even aware that he was acting out that way.
As far as the confederate flag goes, here are my thoughts. In my opinion the southern states committed treason as defined by the Constitution of the United States: “Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort”
I feel no sympathy towards them. They lost and need to accept that. If I were southern I would feel shame that my ancestors committed such treason.
You do not see Japanese or German citizens celebrating their actions in WW2. Rather, they have accepted it, and moved on. They acknowledge their history but do not show pride the actions of their nations during those times.
If you wish to express your indignity on being told “what to do” fly the Gadsden Flag.
Porter I would not be surprised one bit if the Confederate Flag becomes the Anti-Political Correctness symbol of the 22nd century. Of course everyone who does not kowtow to the Liberal drive by media is racist today though that will change as even people of non-Caucasian ancestry are figuring out that the Liberal agenda is a killer for working families Wrongly assumed racism in America is a power driver for the few non-Caucasian leaders who rely on division to maintain their power base.
Charlie please propose a bill stating South Dakota is leaving the union and require the federal government to continue to pay for those on Social Security, etc… or payback what we have paid in. I would gladly pay an income tax in SD instead of a federal one. The country is in a death spiral with mounting debt and refusal to have a balanced budget, but lets focus instead on political correctness and gay pride. This country’s morals and common sense are spiraling down the toilet and I feel our South Dakota values are being diluted by the federal government.
I typed-up my thoughts on the issue. Here it is if anyone’s interested:
The shooting in South Carolina restarted a national conversation about the proper place of the confederate flag in government and in public. The arguments are old, but unlike prior uproars, this time the Confederate flag is losing. As we lay the Southern symbol to rest, let’s put the debate in the proper context.
Opponents believe the flag is a symbol of racism and hate and nothing more. Supporters say hate groups hijacked the flag and it was never about slavery, racial discrimination or hate. In a way, both groups are right and both are wrong.
The southern states are a ferociously independent bunch. Note that the South spawned not just one, but two claims of independence from the United States government. Throughout the elections, the debates, the amendments and the wars, the South was consistent: they would not tolerate dictates or admonishments from a federal authority sitting on-high.
When Virginia seceded from the Union, Robert E. Lee followed his home state rather than accept a commission from President Lincoln. General Lee would not accept the top spot with the Confederate forces until sometime later. Like other Southerners, the General held a greater allegiance to his state than to the federal government. Interestingly enough, General Lee was personally opposed to slavery.
In this sense, the civil war could have revolved around access to a fishing spot. Had the federal government engaged such access in the same way they engaged slavery, the South still may have seceded and fought a war for their independence.
However, the issue of the day was not access to a fishing spot. The issue of the day was slavery. In this way, bifurcating the philosophical objections and the public policy issues of the time seems disingenuous. For these reasons, both sides are right, and both sides are wrong.
That brings us to today, and the first issue to address is what the confederate flag represents. Most directly, it represents a country that stood in opposition to the United States and lost. Unlike other countries defeated by the United States in war, the Confederacy also ceased to exist. They lost the war and the nation evaporated. In the most direct sense, the Confederate flag represents a failed state.
Interestingly enough, South Carolina did not fly the Confederate flag on their capital grounds until 1961, further demonstrating it’s symbolic status of opposition to the United States. Here is our first truth: the Confederate flag represents an idea only and nothing tangible. It is not a battle for property or possessions, but a battle for the mind.
It may seem superfluous to mention that the South lost the civil war, but it helps make a point. No one I know fears the South rising again to challenge the North. It’s a non-issue. In the same way, no one I know fears the KKK or segregationists rising again to challenge a society that favors integration of all races.
So where does the recent attack in Charleston fit? The 1963 bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church was similar, but there is one gaping difference: society. In 1963, there was a very real concern that segregationists would grow in power and influence and succeed in further limiting for minorities access to justice, voting, restaurants, drinking fountains and other things. Today, I accept that such a possibility is limited if not impossible.
Today’s reactions to the violence and the massive calls to furl the flag denote not mere sadness, but fear. Immediate reactions of this nature always carry with them at least a tinge of fear. If we do not fear the rise of the South, or the mass societal influence of segregation, we’re left with a fear far more base. In the words of FDR, “The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.”
Therefore, the reaction we see today represents a faceless foe, a fear of hate, a fear of misunderstanding, and a fear of violence. And what provokes this fear? The Confederate flag. Historically, is it accurate? That’s debatable, in which case we’d start from the beginning and find ourselves in the dead end of circular reasoning.
This brings us to our second truth and the conservative off-ramp. The best government is limited. Strong, independent states are an asset. States test solutions, some work and some do not. Values, traditions and morals are best protected locally, not nationally. And the Confederate flag is not the best symbol for that message.
Whether one believes the Confederate flag represents slavery, segregation and discrimination, you cannot deny that the public policy issues of the day were slavery, segregation and discrimination. Further, the Confederate strategy was to stand in opposition to the United States and thereby its founding documents. The Confederate flag belongs in museums and classrooms, and it’s history and meaning should be studied and debated. But make no mistake, while the Confederate flag is part of American history it is not American. It never was and never will be. Rightly or wrongly, it now connotes the worst and most base of all emotions and conveys a message unlike that expressed by General Lee when he acted in defense of Virginia.
As small “c” conservatives, let’s take the flag down (voluntarily, not officially) and focus our attention on the coming election. President Obama expanded the federal government to levels never seen before. The next election will have a major impact on whether America succeeds in bringing about a more limited government or falls to an all-powerful federal authority.
Thank you for taking the time to compose this, Mr. Pilcher. Succinct, rational, and yet still “conservative” (as you note), and most of all, American. Good for you for pointing this out: “But make no mistake, while the Confederate flag is part of American history it is not American. It never was and never will be.”
You make the dispositive point, and it could not have been better written.
I salute you. BF
When I moved to DC in 1981 to got to college and not counting when I was a toddler and my parents moved to California for a year), I had been out of South Dakota three times (unless you count minor border crossings into North Dakota and Nebraska) and two of those trips had been to Minneapolis. At that time, I had a visceral reaction to the Confederate Flag (and its various derivations such as the Battle flag of the Army of Northern Virginia) including seeing it on the car when watching a show I loved (“Dukes of Hazard”).
But, living in Northern Virginia, I came to realize the Confederate Flag (and esp. the Battle Flag of Northern Virginia) had a different meaning to many than pro-slavery or as RLM asserts treasonous against the United States as I had viscerally presumed before I moved.
1) It was a call to southern culture. As a “South” Dakotan, I was accepted as an honorary Southerner with a group which had Alabama roots. These people were without a doubt the most polite people I’ve ever seen around who didn’t “get” the frankness of people from New York or Jersey. Their idea of a good weekend wasn’t going to bars, dancing, or anything active but relaxation. Friday night over a few adult beverages duties were assigned with regard to Saturday which consisted of an afternoon of gathering in a backyard, a bbq for supper and sitting until the wee hours talking about family and friends. I’ll never forget when there was a big Alabama gathering at the battle field in Manassess when there were Blacks there and one wore a shirt with a Confederate Flag. I so wanted to ask him about it but never did. But, in retrospect, maybe it was as natural to him as me wearing a shirt with Mt. Rushmore on it.
2) It was a call to state’s rights but had nothing to do with slavery or civil rights. These people rightly recognized and acknowledged the sins of their past. But, especially my friends from Virginia/West Virginia, they all seemed to have someone in their family that was anti-Prohibition and had a role in moonshine manufacturing or moonshine running. The federal government’s attack on moonshine was seen as an attack on their southern pace of life. See #1 for context.
3) It was who they were-Southerners. The good and the ugly and they shied away from neither. As a Catholic, I knew the KKK pursued Catholics as aggressively as Blacks (there were just fewer of us in the South) so I confronted them on it. They admitted it was part of their past, they didn’t justify or glorify it. But, they put it in the past and made every effort to make sure I didn’t feel uncomfortable. In fact, during a time when I dated a girl from the South, she and her friends encouraged me to make Mass on weekends more than any of my other friends. I came to realize it was a Southern form of contrition or statement it was in the past or just acknowledgement it was who I am and they accepted me.
4) In context of the above, I took two philosophy classes on Logic where I learned about the logic fallacy called Presentism (using current standards, morals, mores to judge people, events, cultures in the past without considering the context in which they occurred).
I still don’t like the Confederate Flag because of what I (imagine the “I” is bolded) see when I see the Confederate Flag. At the same time, I know in my head by my experience that not every person displaying the flag is intending what I (again bolded) see.
One other story which I think is relevant as analogy. As a Northerner, I had heard the watermelon symbol was demeaning to Blacks. However, at another picnic I happened to be at (invited by a gal from North Carolina), I spent an hour trying to “compete” with some Black teens and pre-teems spitting watermelon seeds into small bucket. In the end, I took consolation I could kick their butts at throwing buffalo chips, an activity they thought was insane.
My point: Part of being an American is to tolerate expressions I disagree with (Flying the Confederate Flag to promote slavery, secession from the US or racism) and sometimes it is to acknowledge what I see in a symbol may not be the intention of the person flying the symbol and I might learn something from a neighbor by asking their intention before reacting.
The South Carolina shooter was also wearing pants! In fact, it seems most racists wear pants, even KKK members wear pants under their robes.
Have you ever seen a bigot wearing a kilt or toga?
We must ban pants!
Ms. Beal, we must ban short pants. Not long pants. You never see a custodian wearing short pants or kilts.
Not so fast. What about the janitor on The Simpsons?
Per Curiam,
You are correct. The flag(s) of the Confederate States of America went in the dustbin of history when the war was over. What has continued to be seen are the various battle flags of the various different Armies mostly associated with individual states (ala the Battle Flag of the Army Northern Virginia or Tennessee).
The Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia is the most recognizable today. The Army of Northern Virginia was led by General Robert E. Lee who did not believe in slavery but chose to fight of the Confederacy because of his loyalty to Virginia and states rights.
Further, you have to remember Southerners referred to the Civil War as the “War of Northern Aggression” which belies many saw the war less about slavery than states rights.