An interesting interlude regarding the proposed pot legalization measure.

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I was doing a little bulk shopping in Sioux Falls yesterday at Sams Club with my wife, and happened to run into a Republican State Representative (who I won’t name, as I didn’t ask if I could go public with the conversation) who was doing a little shopping as well. He noted that he read with interest the post I had on Attorney General Marty Jackley releasing his explanation for the initiated measure relating to pot.

We both agreed that more often than not, the people proposing these types of measures were often their own worst enemies, and that they often go too far with what they’re asking for, such as the ballot measure that’s soon going to be introduced for circulation.

Are they simply trying to legalize certain derivative oils for children that physicians can prescribe in the absence of other drugs to reduce the incidence of seizures? Well, no.  I think both he and I (and this may surprise you) thought there could be a pathway to allowing that very limited kind of treatment, if it was prescribed and or administered by physician. The problem gets to be with the awful measures that keep getting thrown at us, and defeated by the voters, and the people out representing them.

The measure that’s set to currently be circulated allows sick minors to obtain pot, but really doesn’t limit the manner of application. So, a 4 year old could smoke it as soon as he can learn how to hold it in his little hand. As the South Dakota Secretary of Health once quipped in legislative committee “We don’t smoke our medicines in South Dakota.”  Not that the people proposing them ever take the hint.

Anyone under the act can designate “a caregiver” who can assist their use of pot.  And guess what? They’ll be able to grow it at home as well.   The act provides for cultivation in “enclosed, locked facilities,” to store or grow pot including “any closet….. that is equipped with locks.”   And who can prescribe the pot being grown in a locked closet? Not a specific type of physician, but a “Practitioner,” which is simply defined as “a person who is licensed with authority to prescribe drugs to humans.”   That could be a doctor.. or some counselors. Or more.

If you have non-smoking apartments, guess what landlord? You might ban tobacco, but you can’t ban pot smokers if they have their pot smoking card. Despite it being as bad for them if not worse than tobacco smoking.

The act being proposed as usual is filled with wide open loopholes, and takes away the ability of property owners to regulate the use of their property. All despite the fact that pot is still illegal at the federal level.

When you have measures in front of you as loose as this, most reasonable people are going to say no. In this instance, the legislator I was speaking with had a bill in front of him just like this during a recent legislative session. Expressing some of the same reservations, the reply wasn’t that the group asking him to sponsor it was going to work on it, or instead propose a much more limited version.

He was hysterically told that he was killing people, and the pot advocates started calling his house and otherwise haranguing him for the next couple of weeks. Really?

Unreasonable advocates who want to throw the door open for people to grow it in their closets and harass people who say no are not the kind of people you want writing & proposing legislation.

And you certainly don’t want them writing wide-open ballot measures that they want people to vote yes on.

43 thoughts on “An interesting interlude regarding the proposed pot legalization measure.”

  1. Good link from the American Lung Association!

    This is an ad from Long Beach, CA on https://weedmaps.com/doctors/cannabis-doctor-long-beach

    Medical Marijuana Doctor open 7 days a week from 11 to 6. Visit our office today for your cannabis recommendation. We offer 24/7 online and phone verification. Our physicians evaluate patients for there marijuana license and marijuana card. Come to the Cannabis Doctor to be evaluated for your medical needs. If our physician determine you qualify for a Marijuana Card, you will receive your Marijuana License same day.

    $25 for renewal. $35 for New Patients

    Will the $25.00 include a bag of chips or Doritos?

    ” Yes, the $25 fee is a joke because cannabis prohibition is a joke. It’s by and large a harmless substance. We all know there are countless recreational users obtaining medical cards”
    Ryan Janssen DFP 6/10/2015

  2. “Why would the bill trump anything on a lease that says it is a non-smoking rental? I think you are just looking for something to complain about. Non-smoking is non-smoking pretty easy to figure out. ” Melissa Mentele

    Because I have had pro-pot advocates tell me I’d be discriminating against them as a rental property owner with strict non-smoking units if they had their medical pot cards and that using a vaporizer is not the same as smoking. Depending on what type of vaporizer they use and if they know just the right particular way to use it they will leave an odor. Vaporizers are banned by the US Navy on submarines and are starting to be banned in public buildings in many cities.

    Odor/stinky rental units are difficult to rent and it’s an additional expense to remove the offensive odor besides having the tenants having to deal with it when the smell seeps into their apartments or public areas.

  3. The quotes below are from Pat’s previous post, less than an hour before this one.

    “Ugh. Should a group of people who want to tell others how they should conduct themselves be able to make a fairly benign behavior illegal because they don’t like it? Should they be able to say ‘don’t do that, because I don’t think that’s good for you, and I’m the decider.’ …

    “So, here come the nanny staters with no solution other than to punish the whole for bad decisions of a few… Promoting a ban on things you don’t like is little more than sticking your head in the sand and saying ‘problem solved.’”

    1. In case you didn’t know, there’s a bit of difference between lending money and illegal drug use.

      But if you don’t think there is, give us your address, and I’m sure we can send some one over with a drug dog to explain it.

      1. can payday loans give off second-hand debt, which would give you a debt of your own simply by close proximity? can you get a contact-deficit?

  4. Make it legal. State can make money it look at Colorado. Our roads and schools can use the funds a lot of people smoke it already. Might as well regulate it. I see more problems with prescription drugs and alcohol than I do with pot

  5. Mr. PP, I have a good friend (let’s call him Bob) asked me to ask you why we don’t smoke our medicines in South Dakota. I told him I’d try but that you were probably not the right medical source for the answer. I told this friend that he needed to man up and admit he wanted to smoke pot for fun. What is your take on the smoking of medicines? Farce or Fact?

  6. Powers said: “So, a 4 year old could smoke it as soon as he can learn how to hold it in his little hand.”

    Don’t you trust the parents? When your daughter is ill, do you hand her the bottle of medicine and walk away? Do we need the state involved in the prevention of terminal cancer patients from using marijuana, for fear of an epidemic of weed-addled toddlers?

    Nearly half the states now, going back 20 years, have legalized marijuana for medical purposes. Know how many have gone back to prohibition? Not one. The states that have tried it have learned that prohibiting medical use of marijuana is foolish at best and heartless at worst. It is nanny-statism of the highest order.

    Very little of your “sky is falling” propaganda is accurate, and whatever merit your argument might have is vastly overwhelmed by the reasons to vote FOR this measure. The nation as a whole is seeing this. The smart states are taking advantage of it by taxing and regulating it, and have been doing so for decades now, to their benefit.

    I concede that we probably will not.

  7. My last “nug” on legal weed in Dakota, is this. Consider the two states that legalized cannabis first. Colorado and Washington. Colorado is an aerospace state and Washington is a high tech state. Both enjoy citizens who’re not averse to figuring ways to get a project accomplished. Both enjoy citizens who see the possibilities not dwell on negativity and contrary direction. Many problems arose while traversing the mountain of legal marijuana legislation (pot has been legal here in some form since November 2000) but careful and considerate dissection of each issue led to proper and equitable solutions each and every time; which are bringing in three million dollars a month in taxes that go to building and maintaining our schools. This is why I don’t believe South Dakota is a good place for medical or retail cannabis, at this time. If it’s going to be like Obamacare and get challenged, thrown shade on and rebuked at every turn why take something that benefits so many and subject it to hateful disrespect? Citizens of South Dakota know where to go to get abortions and they know where to go to get marijuana. It’s been this way for 50 years and the climate and culture show little effort to change.

    1. Funny, the moderates scream and holler about accepting their raise taxes, spend money, create more government, oppose gun rights, oppose pro-life bills ways.. But attack a group of people who are for less government, for individual rights, etc., who never bother anyone other than seeking their right to smoke pot..

      How’d that work out for you Dave R. Supporting the moderate establishment clique?

      1. Because as a fiscal Conservative the social costs will be 10 times what the potheads claim we will save on their recycled tired old argument we would save on the war on drugs by legalizing this wacky weed!

    2. Why not? The best and brightest already leave as quick as possible leaving the “chronically contrary” Republic party to play with itself. lol (figuratively, that is)

      1. The best and brightest ARE moving to SD and ND, and out of liberal wastelands like MN and CO.

        The US Census bureau says so.

        1. I know at least two people that will move from Colorado to South Dakota within the year citing their co-workers coming in stoned or getting stoned at work, can’t practically go anywhere that people are without smelling pot smoke and the increase in minors getting hooked on this stuff.

          “best and brightest” more like numb and dumber

          1. Colorado’s economy is booming. Furthermore, look at the universities throughout the country. A high percent of college students smoke pot. A high percent of college graduates smoke pot and are very productive citizens. Scaring people is no longer going to work.

            1. you mean the people you knew smoked pot does not mean most students and post graduates smoked pot.

      2. Colorado beckons.

        BTW, calling the Republican Party the “Republic party” doesn’t upset Republicans the way Democrats are upset with “Democrat party”.

  8. [email protected] Dave R. ~ “It’s uncertain exactly where USA is headed but one thing is solid. Where ever USA ends up, COLORADO will get there first.”
    -Mr. Powers. Your blog’s poignant comments bring to mind my entry in the new “state motto” contest for South Dakota. It’s a contronym (word or phrase with contradictory meanings) . The new state motto should be, “JUST WATCH” ….. It’s fitting as a “command” when used by your Republic Party. i.e. “Don’t participate in progress. Don’t pitch in on new projects. Don’t embrace new things and ideas. Stay home, sit back and “JUST WATCH!!!” But, also it’s fitting for we liberals insomuch as it’s a challenge. i.e. “JUST WATCH” what we can accomplish when we gather as a single minded collective! ~ @LiberalDakota

    1. “Don’t participate in progress. Don’t pitch in on new projects. Don’t embrace new things and ideas.”

      As opposed to hanging on to old hags like Hlilary?

  9. As usual the pro-weed proponents are not answering questions! I have a number of apartment houses and prohibit smoking. There is no way I’m going to allow stinky vapes to be used in any of my apartments. I don’t care if they have a medical pot card! Why should I have to pay to get that stink out? My renters will raise hell and complain if they smell that crap since they are paying to live in a smoke free building! I’ve been calling other Apartment building owners and we will fight this!

    1. well, if the opponents simply assume the voters are using common sense, and that they’re not swayed by simplistic emotional appeals, then this will be just like the minimum wage bill, and the vacuum where their huge counter-argument should have been will be filled with legal marijuana smoke instead.

  10. I am not even sure where to start with this cluster of misinformation and outright BS.

    Lets start with the original post.

    ” Well, no. I think both he and I (and this may surprise you) thought there could be a pathway to allowing that very limited kind of treatment, if it was prescribed and or administered by physician.” This is a lie we offered this kind of legislation to them in January they refused. I have a nice form letter Steve Hickey shared with us from the AG that was a no.

    “So, a 4 year old could smoke it as soon as he can learn how to hold it in his little hand.” What a bunch of fear mongering bullshit that is. Children are medicated with oils, given by measured ml and is just like any other liquid med given to a child. What kind of monster are you to even write such a ridiculous statement. You need to remember I am a parent and protecting our children is a top priority for me so I find this very offensive.

    “That could be a doctor.. or some counselors. Or more.” I see you have very little faith in the SD Dept of Health. They will be the ones monitoring the Physicians and the prescribing plus they will be checking all of the physicians orders. I have faith that if there is an inconsistency or issue they will find it and fix it.

    “If you have non-smoking apartments, guess what landlord? You might ban tobacco, but you can’t ban pot smokers if they have their pot smoking card. Despite it being as bad for them if not worse than tobacco smoking.” Again not true a non-smoking rental stays a non-smoking rental quit trying to make an issue where there is not an issue. Don’t want vaping then include it on the lease. Easy fix.

    “When you have measures in front of you as loose as this, most reasonable people are going to say no. In this instance, the legislator I was speaking with had a bill in front of him just like this during a recent legislative session. Expressing some of the same reservations, the reply wasn’t that the group asking him to sponsor it was going to work on it, or instead propose a much more limited version.

    He was hysterically told that he was killing people, and the pot advocates started calling his house and otherwise haranguing him for the next couple of weeks. Really?

    Unreasonable advocates who want to throw the door open for people to grow it in their closets and harass people who say no are not the kind of people you want writing & proposing legislation.” This is a loaded statement again not true the CBD extract only was also offered and denied. I personally know the family who brought it forward. Do I believe that saying no has the potential to harm patients and potentially cause the death of children with intractable seizure disorders? Yes I do. Do I think anyone started calling people and harassing them that I cannot answer but I do know it wasn’t anyone from New Approach SD. We work with people and our lawmakers not against. We hope for compromise and for open dialogue.

    “Unreasonable advocates who want to throw the door open for people to grow it in their closets and harass people who say no are not the kind of people you want writing & proposing legislation.
    And you certainly don’t want them writing wide-open ballot measures that they want people to vote yes on.”

    I guess it is a good thing that the advocates that are bringing this forward are not those kind of people then. Home cultivation is not a huge deal it is basically the same as growing tomatoes in a closet. As far as writing the bill well you are going to have to eat some of that statement because it was written by ME and a team of attorneys and legal analysts that looked at every state that is legal and gave SD a fighting chance to pass a law that would help as many patients as possible and allow time for the state to get used to it while putting together and infrastructure to support it. It is a very well written bill.

    Now lets start with the comments. Lynn we covered the rental stuff with the lease. People will have to respect its a non-smoking rental case closed. However the bill protects the patients who are using cannabis in oil, edible and topical forms from discrimination. The non-smoking is just that non-smoking.

    Public cannabis smoking is not something that is an issue in any legal state as most abide by the non-smoking bans and city ordinances are put in place to ban smoking outside of their own home.

    “As usual the pro-weed proponents are not answering questions!” sorry but I have a work to do and am busy I dont have time to sit on blogs and catch every question.

    “I have a number of apartment houses and prohibit smoking. There is no way I’m going to allow stinky vapes to be used in any of my apartments. I don’t care if they have a medical pot card! Why should I have to pay to get that stink out? My renters will raise hell and complain if they smell that crap since they are paying to live in a smoke free building! I’ve been calling other Apartment building owners and we will fight this!”

    There is nothing to fight a non-smoking rental will stay that way the legalization does not change your rights to having smoke free properties.

    Ok so I have a ton of things to do to get ready for the Petition Kick Off Event next Thursday. If you have more questions call me. My phone is 605-299-6982 I have nothing to hide and have 0 issue having a conversation with anyone with questions. We could even have coffee if you are brave enough to meet with the women who is working to change the law. I am a nice person. I have 18 years of health care experience, I am a mom and I love animals, old houses and country values. Come talk to me.

    Melissa

  11. can the derivative oils be incorporated into tobacco and cigarettes? we already have a huge sales tax structure for that in place, smoke is smoke people. how about half and half, call it to-buwana or mari-bacco?

  12. I cannot stress to you enough how this movement is not about smoking anything. People will smoke it but for medical patients access to the oils for children, the edibles for cancer patients, vaping for pain and topicals for arthritis should be your focus. The combustion of cannabis through smoking doesn’t allow for the compounds in the plant to work effectively. Vaporizing is a option that heats the plant to a low temp to release the CBD’s and then higher to release THCa and THC. There is virtually no smoke and no odor. Smoking is really just as passe among the cannabis community as cigarette smoking is to the general public so please stop focusing on smoking.

    1. Melissa –

      Maybe I missed it, but where in the proposed medical pot act act does it preclude the method of pot ingestion allowed under the act from being allowed as smoking? And along those lines, where exactly does the act subordinate the medical pot user’s rights to that of the building’s owners?

      Because it would certainly seem to be the opposite. “Not subject to penalty” and ” No school or landlord may refuse to enroll or lease..”

      For example….

      Section 2. A cardholder who possesses a valid registry identification card is not subject to arrest, prosecution, or penalty in any manner, or denial of any right or privilege, including any civil penalty or disciplinary action by a court or occupational or professional licensing board or bureau for….. The medical use of cannabis pursuant to this Act.

      And…. Section 19. No school or landlord may refuse to enroll or lease to and may not otherwise penalize a person solely for the person’s status as a cardholder…

      And I see nothing in the act which denies it’s manner of ingestion in the form of lighting it up as a joint. So, if some idiot holding a card as a caretaker wants to give their 4 year old a joint, or a cardholder wants to grow pot in their closet and smoke it in their apartment, it appears the measure put them in the drivers’ seat.

      So, your protests fall far short of reality.

      The reality of your act is that it takes rights away from employers, schools and landlords. I also notice it bars state & local law enforcement from enforcing certain federal laws (Section 16).

      When the attorney general noted that “No person or entity may be penalized, or denied any right or privilege, for conduct that is lawful under the measure.” and “Schools and landlords cannot penalize, or refuse to enroll or lease, based solely on a person’s cardholder status…” he’s not kidding, he’s just citing the act.

      It’s a bad measure for South Dakotans, and should do as poorly as it did last time out.

      1. I realize this will be your pitch against the measure, regardless of anyone’s efforts to persuade you otherwise, but you’re wrong on the law. The bill prevents landlords from denying a lease. The terms of those lease are still determined by the landlord, who is free to prohibit smoking (or vaporizing) marijuana in the premises, just like cigarettes or anything else.

        I do acknowledge that this question would likely be settled through litigation.

        Your interpretation of the breadth of the measure is a guaranteed loser in court, and is really just fear-mongering.

  13. The bill is written to not allow discrimination regarding a “card holders status” it does not say that a card holders status trumps a lease. If a building is smoke free it would not have to have it status changed due to this law passing. However based solely on a patients cardholder status they could not be denied housing if their form of MMJ was not smoking related or if the property was not smoke free. There are plenty of apartments and rental homes in CO that enforce the non-smoking with 0 issues. The funny thing with you all having a come apart regarding the smoking ban is that you act like this bill will create users and every tenant will have a MMJ card. At last patient poll statewide we had roughly 150 patients who were interested and would qualify. I am sure most of them heck I will say 50% of them are homeowners or are pediatric patients living in their family homes. There isn’t going to be a rush of cannabis users needing housing due to this law passing. We have a lot of baby boomers and snowbirds that are current supporters and 20% of the patients qualified were 60 and up.

    The part about the schools refusing enrollment is for our handicapped children who would like to be part of the immersion programs in public schools this law protects their medical status and will also allow the school nurse to medicate the child based on their status and needs. This is also a new law in CO that just passed the governors desk it helps keep the kids involved and makes sure that rescue meds and daily scheduled meds are accepted.

    There is no limits on how a person chooses to medicate. What works for some may not work for others but you all focus on the smoking like it is the only route of administration and it is not. Many MMJ patients are non-smokers.

    As far as section 16 it is basically making sure the state follows federal law. It mirrors this: http://www.drugpolicy.org/blog/three-marijuana-amendments-pass-us-house-representatives
    I would suggest you brush up on US cannabis laws and new policies that are being brought forward and passing. You will then see we just put all of it in the bill for our state….we know how hard it is for SD to play catch up.

    1. The issues have already gone before the Colorado Supreme Court (just as an aside) which ruled that an MMJ card doesn’t remove any rights from an employer or a landlord. A boss can fire you for being a pot smoker, even after work and a landlord can impose any rights (except banning children, seniors or disabled) they choose.

  14. so many advocates would assure us that the issue isn’t at all about people being able to light up with impunity, and about having everyone smoke the substance. it’s about pain management, it’s about legally authorized alternatives and traditional delivery systems and promising data from the legalizing states. yet, the actual fact is that when it’s legalized so many occasional users, who smoke, will expect and act on a perceived expansion of their safe zone for smoking weed. that’s just the way it is, and it’s disingenuous to be so stridently dismissive of that. please.

    1. Why don’t you trust doctors, Enquirer? This initiative is for medical use, not recreational. You need a doctor to sign off on it.

      Will some people fake symptoms to qualify? Sure, there will be some level of abuse, just like there is with every other legal medicine. And yes, everyone who supports recreational legalization is sure to support medical legalization as well.

      That doesn’t mean the whole thing is a scam. Right now there are South Dakotans who could obtain significant relief from serious diseases if they had legal access to marijuana. They don’t, and that’s wrong.

      1. i’m referring to the upshot of passage and practical effect thereafter, but just keep on blahblahblahblahblahblah. you’re not admitting anything either obviously.

  15. I am dismissive for the fact that the patients that I advocate are not those people. I know there will be the people who are dumb and force the hand of law enforcement. I know they exist and that is why there are still penalties in the law for those who do that. Read the whole bill please. While there are many protections there are also many penalties.

    When I tell you the patients in SD are unique I mean it. We have everyone from a 2 year old who needs oil for seizure control (meet him in Sundays Argus Leader), a 19 year old with epilepsy, 22 year old with brain injury, 32 year Crohns patient who needs to juice the whole plant. 27 year old with MS all the way up to our snowbirds who go to legal for the winter and are using topical creams/transdermal patches for pain. Oils are primarily the need out of all of the them statewide I would say under 10% actually are smokers.

    I want to introduce you to some of the various cannabis products. Keep in mind non of these are able to be shipped due to laws regarding trafficking so SD will have a golden opportunity to have business like them come to SD.

    Let’s start with a dispensary I am sure people think they are some shady looking places kinda like the naughty store downtown Sioux Falls with the sketchy alley. That is not the case. This is my favorite place in CO to visit. They have great coffee cups for legal souvenirs.

    http://thefarmco.com/

    Then lets start with trans dermal patches & creams these work wonderful for pain and arthritis.

    http://www.marysmedicinals.com/

    Lets look at oils. The Flowering Hope Foundation is a wonderful organization. They are compassionate and Jason Cranford is a well educated experienced cannabis product maker. They currently make a oil called Haleighs Hope. If you follow national cannabis news you will know that Georgia law was changed for Haleigh last month. Call Allen Peake and talk to him about why he as a state rep for Georgia championed a law to save her life. They also make a product to treat Chrohn’s Disease called Cannitol. They made the medicine that put the 1st US patient into clinical remission without the risk of cancer like Humira. Coltyn Turner has been in clinical remission for over a year.

    http://www.floweringhope.co/#mission

    Enjoy the info and enjoy the weekend.

  16. In 2014, Colorado collected $20 million in tax revenue from medical marijuana sales alone (along with another $56 million in taxes from recreational sales). We couldn’t match that here of course, but we could get something.

    Meanwhile, we have a crisis in teacher salaries. Last in the nation.

    The social harm from marijuana is wildly overstated, and to whatever extent it exists, it’s dwarfed by the harm that comes from alcohol and tobacco. This is a fact. And almost all marijuana transactions (medical and otherwise) are going to occur regardless of whether or not this measure passes, just like they are now. So why not bring it into the light of day? Regulation actually mitigates any risks, and we get an additional stream of tax revenue in a state that desperately needs it. It’s a no-brainer.

  17. Dave R,

    Until you said it, I didn’t even know Port was doing that. Their skins are so thin because they are so intellectually vacuous. Good catch.

    1. mr jones, thanks for the pingback reviewing marty jackley’s views on the question of legalization and what governments need to have in place. what is very clear: there’s either ONE position, like jackley advocates, with a strict medicinal-only control and application of the substance, with doctors involved just like with any other non-otc drug in the u-s …. OR …. the OTHER position, where you put out the emotional appeal of the poor souls who need the medicinal approval BUT put forth a law that greatly sanctions the home-growth and/or relatively easy procurement of marijuana plants, and totally refuse to discuss the 900 pound gorilla in the room, i.e. that passage with such a seeming sanction in place via the detailed rules will result in a tacit approval of much illegal personal abuse of marijuana on a recreational basis, by those who already don’t care about or follow laws against it and many more whose own recreational use is hindered or stopped by the current illegality of it. so this is the impasse. no amount of medical information will sway me because of the implied sanction and tacit approval of illegal personal use/abuse with which i disagree. and i would reiterate my other point, that the somewhat easy passage of the minimum wage bill with its egregious wording and problems should serve as a lesson for those who would assume that such a problematic marijuana approval referendum would fail on its face. not if you don’t fight the fight.

    2. colorado is going to know just what the seemingly small corruption of government function adds up to over time. rapid city has a one-block blight area called ‘art alley’ in the downtown, inagurated as a way to turn graffiti-makers into artists and channel their artistic expression. when the idea of it was floated, the artists rushed in to make it happen, and then it was the city’s call on whether to allow it to continue to exist by suspending the code enforcement they’d implement otherwise. it’s a one-block walking tour, open day and night, requiring special security during the tourist season, but one could note that the practical effect of it all is a taking from the building owners on the block, i.e. they’ve lost control of the alley-facing surfaces of their property, and i think the suspension of government functions amounts to corruption. this kind of look-the-other-way corruption is the natural companion to the legalization of medicinal marijuana, and certainly attorney general jackley has quite clearly put that notion on the record. again, thanks sir.

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